Let's Talk About Sex

[jackofallgeeks]

So I have this friend, we'll call her Laurel. Laurel's a teacher, or was and will be again once she finishes her Master's Degree. She seems to like working with teen-aged kids. And through all of this, one of the things that bothers he is the lack of information and, worse, the misinformation that kids get regarding sex. I don't think she's on any grand crusade (yet), but she's found a book that she likes, "The Naked Truth About Sex," and has asked me to read though it, as a differing opinion.

'Opposing opinion' is probably a better way of putting it, and that's not just from me; I'm pretty sure she was thinking along those lines, something like "let's see what someone on the Other Side thinks of this book." In most of my circles, I'm The Catholic. And in most circles that's pretty accurate, so I'm not faulting her. Just setting the stage.

Because the point is I'm not here to talk about the book. I'll mention it, yeah, and I'll tell you right now that my initial impression of it is middling-to-negative. But it's got me thinking about a number of things. All of them having to do with sex, of course. Which is really why this post is locked.

I don't talk about sex. On the few occasions that I've mentioned it, those around me have been shocked and scandalized that I would even know what those words mean. Knowing more than I appear to has always been part of my game. But upon reflection, I think this -- the not talking about sex -- is a flaw.

And that's the point of this post, and the group it's attached to. Somewhere to talk about sex. And no, nothing too overly graphic; I'm still a virgin and plan to remain so for some time yet, how graphic could it get? But having someplace where I can go and discuss these things when they occur to me... that's something that I think might be helpful.

So, there you have it. If you can see this, you're currently on the list. If you'd like to NOT be on the list, say so; I'll take you off and we can mutually forget this ever happened. If you can't see this and WANT to be on the list... Well, that presents a difficulty; one of those "raise your hand if you're not here," sorts of things. I'll deal with that somehow.

As of now, you can see this if you're Jenny, Sarah, Nick, Nifer, Kate, Liz, Leslie, Laurel, Mel or Jesse.

(And for Laurel's benefit, the reason I'm leaning negative on the book is mainly because his take on the whole subject smacks of hedonism, a philosophy I personally find distasteful. Early on he even uses the line, "if you're not hurting yourself or someone else, it's OK," which grates on me for a number of philosophical reasons. At that, though, he's definitely a rationally-minded man, he's not advocating the worse extremes we Conservatives fear, and if he seems to be leaning strongly left it can generally be pardoned because he has an uphill battle to get to 'moderate.' He does say some things I agree with, but he often goes further than I'd feel comfortable with.)

Edit (2/2/07 09:30): Added a few more people, Louis, Anastasiya, Erin, Rachel, and Beth. As noted, if you're uncomfortable hearing me talk about sex, feel free (nay, obliged) to opt-out. I don't expect any of you to be put off by the subject matter, of course; it's more a matter that it's me talking.

Comments

[nif.livejournal.com]

I'm perfectly alright with being on the list. Although, looking at the list of other people on said list, I would possibly recommend adding a guy. I mean, women are certainly a great resource to talk about this sort of thing with, but we can only provide half the story. I think. I don't know. I've never been male. Anyway.
As far as sex-ed in school.. I'm a big liberal, but I'm also a big anarchist which means I don't think the government should tell me or my kids shit. There's nothing wrong with taking sex-ed out of schools. Why? Because then it's up to the parents. And if the parents think leaving their children completely ignorant of a basic human drive is good and something happens to them, then it's survival of the fittest. Now, most people totally won't agree with that which means it will never happen. So I have no real problem with sex-ed as it stands, I feel like it's my responsibility to fill in any gaps or expand on that base of information.
Shrug. Anyway.
Just post whenever you need to talk, Andrew. We're all here. :)

[jackofallgeeks.livejournal.com]

Well, looking over my friends-list, there are precious few guys to choose from! -laughs- And at that, even fewer I feel, y'know, *that* comfortable with. Point of fact, I really barely know Nick, but... -shrugs- And, strictly speaking, I'm not really looking for a 'balanced' view type thing, here; with the possible exception of Jenny, I think everyone on this list is quite a bit more liberal than I am. All of this, the lack of guys and the tendency towards liberalism, is really just a function of my circles of friends. I'm just putting up a place where I *can* talk about sex, if that makes sense.

And, actually, I generally agree with you on the sex-ed in schools thing, mostly because we agree that the government should just leave us alone (and more importantly for me, the government shouldn't raise our kids).

[surichan.livejournal.com]

Bring it, as they say, on. :3

awwww...

[xenu.livejournal.com]

You're cute!

[surichan.livejournal.com]

::beams:: Thank you!

Right back atcha. :3

[xenu.livejournal.com]

I'm always up for a good discussion, as you surely know (perhaps to your chagrin, but nevertheless). Also, I'm curious. What philosophical issue do you have with "as long as it doesn't hurt you or anyone else?"

[jackofallgeeks.livejournal.com]

Because it's a pretty little phrase that sounds nice but really means little, if anything at all. First there's the problem of what's meant by 'hurting.' Physical, mental, emotional, spiritual? And it gets stickier when you recognize that it's used to justify pretty much anything between 'two consenting adults' -- which I'll note includes B&D and S&M, so you've pretty much shot down any conventional senses of 'hurting.' Never mind the fact that, most physical harm aside, it's arguably difficult to see the effects of harm, to gauge whether you are or are not hurting someone else; or, even, yourself. If you allow for a spiritual reality, which I do, how do you know you aren't hurting yourself in some metaphysical sense? There's just far too much complexity in the whole thing, and "don't hurt anyone" just kind of sweeps it all under the rug, hums really loudly, and ignores it. It boils down to "do it because you want to." And I don't like that.

[higheststar.livejournal.com]

OOh i am glad I got to be on the list....as long as my opinion is not strange to you. And if sex is involved, I agree with you that it is pretty hard to even know the implications of what might hurt somehow in the future.

[jackofallgeeks.livejournal.com]

-smirk- Putting you on here was just about as hard as putting Jenny on here, but... Well, that's just 'cause I'm shy and stupid. I doubt your opinion will be 'strange,' though there's a chance we'll disagree. I'm OK with that; I disagree with most of my friends about a lot of things.

Re: getting hurt, I think it extends to pretty much everything, but that expands the conversation to a much wider philosophic discussion, so limiting it to just sex is fine in this context, too. Or something. :p

[raen.livejournal.com]

Ready
Set
Go!

eyes like neon signs, flashing open open open at all times...

[singinteenangst.livejournal.com]

YAY! i'm glad to be included in this group. i'm SO comfortable with talking about sex, it will probably be YOU who gets uncomfortable!

i have stories, opinions, other people's stories...oh, sex, you complicated aspect of human nature, how you fascinate me.

and so far, my opinions are as such:

"doesn't hurt you or someone else..." - Andrew, fabulous reasoning. you put into detailed and crystal clear words what my initial reaction was.

sex-ed in schools - i had always thought it should be there, but then the idea of putting the responsibility on the parents came up, and i like that. because a lot of parents in today's society are SO STUPID. it's like they didn't even think about what having a child, and especially what RAISING a child would involve. and i'm talking about people who actively decided to have children, not the "oops"'s, cuz that's a whole other situation. so... i'm all for sex-ed in school, and i support passing out free condoms, and i'm against using only scare-tactics to keep kids abstinent, and i wish parents didn't suck so much.

the end.

[jackofallgeeks.livejournal.com]

-laughs and laughs-

The implication of this whole post is that I'm already uncomfortable! :p And I only felt a little weird putting you on here, in that "she's my little cousin" kinda way. But... I donno, you fit. It as more difficult for me to get Rachel on here (for reasons I can't quite pin down) and I certainly can't justify adding Meredith (even though odds are she never checks LJ any more).

Re: doesn't hurt -- I'm really glad to hear you say that. It seems to me that the whole hedonistic thing is far, far to prevalent in our society, and... -shrugs- I expect I'm in a rather small minority.

Re: sex ed in schools -- I'm undecided. But then, I'm generally against schools as such, mostly because I don't trust (1) that they work or (2) someone else to raise my kids. So... undecided but leaning against on principle, except for the fact, as I plan to touch on n another post sometimes, that a lot of people don't get any formal kind of education in sex at all. And I can see that as irresponsible at the very least, but at the same time, possibly unlike my dear friend Nifer, I'm not so keen on the idea of punishing kids because their parents are stupid. But there's a lot to unpack in that, hence the separate post.

and I'm done.